Instrument Change in Front Ensemble and Staff Style Change issues - FIN 2011

I am working in Finale 2011 and am having some trouble with this whole new mapping and playback thing.  I am using the Finale 2011 Template that Tapspace sells, so I have all the different Staff styles lists to choose from,  but when I follow the directions from the read me to make a staff style change (example: Vibraphone changing to Tambourine) nothing happens.
I am doing playback through VST and have an empty bank set up (I typically do this with all my front ensemble members since they will all play multiple instruments at some point) with Vibe in channel 1 and Tambourine in Channel 2.  When I enter the notes in the area where the staff style was supposedly applied, it does nothing different at all.  It just turns the note heads orange.  It will playback the correct sound because I created an expression text that has a patch change, but my issue is that the score and parts do not change to all the wonderfully mapped out templates that were provide with the template you guys created.  It does not change the staff details seemingly at all other than the noteheads changing color (I believe this is just their way of saying this note is not ";in the range"; of the instrument, but I am not sure?) Any help here would be greatly appreciated.  I used to be able to do this in Finale 2009, but now with the new mapping, the learning curve is frustrating me greatly!


Scott Ward
I am having the exact same problem.  It sounds like you and I use the same writing method, Scott.  I assign a bank in Kontakt to each staff/channel in my score, then drop instruments into each bank's slots.  I then create [b]Expressions[/b] with the corresponding Patch assignments to the slot numbers in the banks.
The sounds work, but the note placement on the staff is incorrect...and the noteheads are orange.  I read that orange noteheads mean that those notes have not been assigned within a map.
I just can't seem to figure out how to re-assign those notes to other lines/spaces on the staff.

The mapping used to be much more user-friendly in earlier versions of Finale than it seems to be now.
If I could just figure out the mapping, I think I could figure the rest out as I go.
I can't imagine that there are only 2 or 3 of us having this problem.  I expected to see a ton of postings about this topic.

Anyone have any insight?  
The problem is not with the mapping or percussion layouts but in getting the staff style changes to function. This was a problem in 2010 with the new mapping system which affected the staff styles.

The process involves using both a staff style change and using expressions to cover everything including percussion layout, switching from non-pitched to pitched percussion, and the actual instrument change. Somewhere along the line something was broken. Figuring out what is wrong and how to fix it is at the top of my list.

I would suggest that this discussion be moved over to The Write Score forums as responsibility for developing and maintaining VDL templates is now their domain. 
Thanks, Ted, for that bit of info.

I've gone ahead and started a thread at The Write Score Forum as Ted suggested.  Feel free to jump in on that one, folks.

I spent time this afternoon and believe I have a solution. This worked using an empty bank and loading a vibe instrument into patch slot 1 and the concert bass drum into slot 2 of the bank.

- Assign a text expression at the beginning of the score for the primary instrument (in this case it was a vibe). I used the Vibe (med. mallets) expression included with the template. You can also create your own. This text expression is for playback and should specify patch change and indicate the bank slot for that sound.

- When you are ready to switch instruments (patches), apply a staff style to that region of measures. The staff style should take care of the mapping as you add instruments but has no affect on playback.

- After entering notes, I used simple entry, add a text expression for the patch change to this instrument. Like the vibe expression, playback will be a patch change and should indicate the bank slot for this particular instrument.

- This last step seems to be the missing link, and one I don't recall needing when developing the templates. You must create a second text expression with playback set to Percussion MIDI Map. Select the percussion midi map for this particular instrument from the drop down list. For this expression I did not include actual text, just a description of the expression for the library dialog box. The reasoning is that having multiple text expressions would make the score look cluttered. You could give them both the same name with different descriptions but the expressions dialog box might become confusing to navigate.

- When you are ready to switch back, use the text expression for the primary instrument.

As I said, this worked using an empty bank to start. It allowed me to go from a pitched percussion instrument (vibes) to a non-pitched percussion instrument (concert bass drum) on a pitched percussion staff. I used Simple Entry to enter notes for both the vibes and bass drum. I did not try using Speedy Entry to place notes. The only issue I have not solved is that the percussion layout for the bass drum shows 'Custom #' for some sounds regardless of entry system. This seems to be only appearing within the staff styles display of the percussion layouts not those in the staff attributes menu.

I appreciate your patience.
First off, thanks Ted for working on this.  This has frustrated me for quite some time, and it is nice to know that there may be hope at the end of the tunnel!

OK, so kind of have this working....So, when I enter notes using my MIDI keyboard the notes do not map correctly.  When I enter them through either simple entry or speedy entry without the MIDI keyboard I am able to get notes mapping to the correct lines (I think...).

I have attached a screen shot.  The first 3 measures are a vibe part that was entered using a MIDI keyboard and speedy entry.  The next three measures are Rack Combo A (all the notes from C1 to C6.  Most of these notes are not mapping the way they are supposed to, but a few of them are.  The last three measures were written by using speedy entry, but not using a MIDI keyboard.  Essentially, I moved the cursor as low as it would go using the down arrow key, then hit 3 for a 16th note, hit the up arrow once, hit 3, etc.  That seemed to work correctly. 

I will say that I did not have to use a second expression.  I used one to change the patch, and only used the staff style that came with the template to change the layout.

Any of you Finale guys know why it wouldn't work in Speedy entry with a MIDI keyboard? 


Thanks for the update. I'll need to take some time to play with the Speedy Entry then to figure out what is happening. Have you tried using Speedy Entry plus the second expression? The staff style places the notes in the correct staff position. I'm guessing that the percussion midi map expression should help remove the other mapping problems.

To clarify,

- I applied the bass drum staff style
- entered notes with simple entry
- added the expression for the patch change
- added the expression for the percussion midi map change

Playback between adding expressions resulted in no bass drum sound

Removing the staff style change resulted in the entered notes changing to a different staff position
Thanks for working on this, Ted.  It's good tech support on your part.
Your welcome. Keep me posted as to results, both positive and negative.
Login or Signup to post a comment